Macedonians, Slavs, and Greeks

Comments

July 3, 2009 at 11:30 am

(1) Mario says:

I dont see why they should not celebrate their connection to Alexander. They inhibit they same lands as he did!

At some point in time Slavic speaking tribes took control over the area and the language of the land eventually changed, but the majority were still (ethnically) Macedonians – the people of Alexander.

As i well known the ancient Macedonians could not participate in the Olympic games, since the other helladians did consider them to be barbarians.

July 4, 2009 at 4:13 am

(2) Demostenes says:

Actually, it doesn´t matter at all. The importance of Alexander´s conquers was more related with the Greek world than with the Slav culture. Macedonians thought themselves as Greeks, even when Greeks from other poleis could consider them otherwise (as barbarians, for example), al least until the Hellenistic period.

The ethnic factor is not relevant for the history in this case. Macedonians were educated as Greeks and, in fact, their culture were in some points more “Greek” than the education in other poleis. The conquered lands were deeply hellenized as a consequence of this.

The founding story of the Macedonians is probably a myth, but that doesn´t means than Macedonians were not culturally Greeks. Most Greeks from the colonial world were also mixed with the local population and had different and complex ethnic connections. As far as they talked a Greek dialect, and were citizens or members of a polis, they were also considered Greeks.

July 9, 2009 at 1:10 am

(3) Georgina says:

At that time, Greece was not unified so muck like other city states such as Sparta, Thessaly and others, Macedonia was an empire in its own right; governed by its own ruler in its own state so the Greeks lived separetly under their own ruler in their own city-states. It was actually his father Philip who unified most of the Greek city states and then Alexander who actually unified Greece.
Yes, the word Macedonian is a Greek word and was given to describe uncultured, undeducated, unsophisticated, basic people living on the land however, I am inclined to believe this applied to a minority of people living on the land rather than an entire empire of people. I would think that people in neighbouring regions dispersed and moved into the region and the first ruler took control of the land hence, taking on the name of the region, Macedonians. The fact that they were called Macedonians in no way indicates that such people were of Slavic background. They were simply the inhabitants living of the land. They could very well have been of Greek background and were so called Macedonians as they were not as developed compared to rest of the Greeks living in other city-states such as Athens, Thessaly and the like.
More importantly, ancient archeological relics and artefacts found in this region are evidence that there was strong Greek influence and traces of Hellenic culture in this region.

My next point to look at is Alexander’s parentage. His father’s background is surrounded in myth being that he was said to be a descendant of Heracles from his paternal side and Archilles from his maternal side – probably as writers wanted to portray Alexander and his stregths and conquests as descending from such powerful beings – both are well known Greek mythological heroes however, we cannot rely on this to support his Greek heritage given its mythological nature. His mother was Olympias who was the daughter of the King of Epirus – part of northern Greece. I think it is safe to say that you would be hard pressed to find a Slavic person whose name is Olympia and is not of Greek background.

Alexander the Great was tutored by both Aristotle (as in the great philosopher) as well as Leonidas further adding weight to the argument of strong Hellenic influence and culture, so definately strong Hellenic influence in his life and upbringing.

Furthermore, in his quest to conquer, Alexander spread Greek teachings, ideologies and philosophies to all places he conquered even to the point of asking his army to greet him like they did the Gods. His horse’s name was Buchephalus which means “big head” in Greek once again proving the strong Hellenic influence in his life and upbringing. His generals were Ptolemy, Nearchus to name a few and historic writers included Plutarch, a Hellene.

So, I conclude that Alexander the Great was Macedonian – because at that time the Greeks were not unified – so I believe it is correct to call him a Macedonian as Macedonia was an empire in its own right but evidence does show that the people living on this land ie. the Macedonians were in fact Greeks and at the very least, these people were certainly living as Greeks and were heavily influenced by Hellenic culture, education, philosophy and the Greek way of life.

July 9, 2009 at 3:18 am

(4) Stratos Soubassakis says:

Hello people!
Alexander himself and the whole Macedonian royalty, claimed Herculean descendancy.
Slavs invaded that part of the Hellenic Peninsula around the 7th century AD, assisted by the Romans, who saw them as border keepers.
Makednos (the patriarch of Macedonians) is son of Zeus, was born before the mythical times and writers mention it before the classical times, even. Hesiod writes it, among others, in a poem!
When Americans claim that they are Cherokee, Maya, Aztec, Mikmak, or some other American tribe, we will understand the utopic claim made by Slavs!

July 9, 2009 at 4:58 am

(5) Alexandros Basis says:

Please follow the link below to read a letter by Proff. Stephen G. Miller sent to the “Archaeology” Magazine.

It will help a lot!

A NON Greek Scientist speaks about the Macedonian-Greek relation.

http://www.phys.uoa.gr/~nektar/history/articles/stephen_miller_letter_to_archaeology_magazine.htm

In addition:
PHILIPPOS = Phil + Hippo (Phil=the one who likes + Hippo=horses)
ALEXANDROS = Alex + Andros (Alext=he one who fights + Andros=Men )

Both names have Greek roots and are used till today in modern Greek.

Regards
Alex

July 9, 2009 at 6:09 am

(6) Brian Daly says:

Today Macedonians speak a Slavic language and for the most part are descendants of Slavic invaders . In Alexander’s time they were a people who spoke a language which might be called a dialect of Greek. During the middle ages Slavs invaded and migrated into what is now Greece .

July 9, 2009 at 12:59 pm

(7) Alex Basis says:

Concerning what Brian Daly wrote.
He is right on the dialect spoken at the time of Philipp and Alexander. But Philipp decided that the official language of his state will be the then (common) Greek language.
The area occupied by the Macedonians at the time of Philipp and Alexander is today divided into three parts.
One part belongs to today’s Greece, including the old capital Pella and the big city o Thessaloniki (Salonika) – both names are Greek. This part is the Greek province called “Macedonia”. In this part the spoken language is modern Greek.
A second part (small) belongs to today’s Bulgaria. In this part the spoken language is Bulgarian.
The third part (which is the Northern part) belongs to the F.Y.R.O.M. (Former Yugoslavian Republic of Macedonia) which was called VARDARSKA till the end of the Second World War. President Tito decided to turn its name to Republic of Macedonia, but not as an independent country, as it was a part of the “Great Yugoslavia”, a Tito’s idea and dream.
After Yugoslavia (under Milosevic) lost the war, Yugoslavia was divided into Serbia, F.Y.R.O.M. e.t.c. The state of F.Y.R.O.M. (this is the official name in the United Nations) has Albanians and – majority – Slavs (and of course some Bulgarians, Greeks, Turks and Serbs). The Albanians have their own dream (“Great Albania”) and don’t care about the name of the country and what was Alexander. The official language of the country is a dialect of the Bulgarian language with a mixture of Slav language.
During the Middle Ages the Slavs came and invaded ONLY THE NORTHERN PART of the Balkan Peninsula. At that time the strong Byzantine Empire (as was called later on the New Rome) had under its control what is Greece today. After the Turks concurred Constantinopolis (today called IS-TAN-POLIS=TO THE CITY, that finally became Istanbul) the area was under the Turkish occupation. So, the Slavs NEVER concurred what Greece is today.

July 9, 2009 at 1:50 pm

(8) Benedict says:

Well, this is very interesting.

I think it is a “simple” matter of doing genetic testing to get the true answer.

On PBS it was stated (therefore it must be true!) that it was shown by genetic testing that the Lebanese are the descendants of the Phoenicians. It makes sense to me because the Lebanese I have known in San Francisco have tremendous business sense and have remarkable ability to deal with people of other races or nationalities. I am trying to say that the Phoenicians were fabulous traders and did that better than anybody else for centuries.

Anyway, it is hard to imagine that an army of Greeks would follow somebody into the great unknown who was not totally Greek. Again, Philip calling in Aristotle to tutor his son Alexander is one thing as proof of his “Greekness”, plus was not his mother a priestess of the Greek religion?

Anyway, to avoid rewriting history unnecessarily and simply presenting problems and confusion, let’s have PBS sponsor some genetic testing!

August 4, 2009 at 8:14 pm

(9) Ilija says:

ALEKSANDAR THE MACEDONIAN ,not Alexandar the Great !
Why you are afraid to say Macedonian ???
Aleksandar was NOT an occupator, he was а culture incorporator
First Filip and Aleksandar has fight with Greeks and The Macedonian Falang had DEFEATED the Greeks in 7 battles.Then when the Macedonian Impery attacked the Persya, ocupated Greeks in Persia has fight against Macedonians !
The ancient Macedonians spoken language was like modern Greek ???
This is absolutely WRONG!
Philip, his son Aleksandar and all ancient Macedonians had spoken a language TOTALY DIFFRENT from ancient greek and modern greek, BUT very simular, 80% same language as Modern MACEDONIAN , used today by Macedonians !!!
Then , comunication between Macedonians (MАКЕДОНЦИ) and Greeks was only with interpreters.
A official language in the Macedonian Impery was the Macedonian language, as official ,formal letter was “the demothic letter” – macedonian letter.
In Macedonian language in demotic letter is written the middle of Rosseta Stone.

September 7, 2009 at 5:49 pm

(10) George says:

Ilija, tel me what it means in your language Alexander, Macedonia, Philip, Olympiada, Aristotle…
Thank you